SAGINAW, MI During an online community forum held Wednesday, several heads of Saginaw County police agencies condemned the actions of a Minneapolis officer that led to the death of citizen George Floyd. They also rebuked the officers act of kneeling on Floyds neck.

Is there ever a training where someone would advocate putting a knee on a neck? Absolutely not, said Saginaw County Sheriff William L. Federspiel. Absolutely not, and Ive been doing this job for 33 years Ive never done that, nor have I seen it done. What that officer in Minneapolis did was atrocious, horrible, and it turned my stomach when I watched it.

The sheriff described the actions of Derek Chauvin, the officer seen in the much-circulated video pinning his knee to Floyds neck for several minutes, as being criminal.

Fielding questions about police officers training, Buena Vista Township Police Chief Reggie Williams II spoke with candor.

What took place in Minneapolis, personally, I do not feel was in regards to did (Chauvin) have a lack of training, did he need more, whatever, Williams said. It was because (Chauvin) was not a decent person and he treated someone with indecency. He killed a man. This comes just down to being a good person doing your job the correct way. We need good people doing their job right.

Responding to a question about nonapproved use-of-force tactics, Saginaw Police Chief Robert M. Ruth said one nonapproved tactic is putting your knee on someones neck or applying pressure to someones neck like you saw in the Floyd video. When you see someone struggling for air, or you see another officer doing something wrong, you have a duty to act. You have a duty to pull that person off of them, to stop that from happening.

The officers gave their statements during a Zoom forum held the afternoon of Wednesday, June 3, titled, What is Our Relationship? Addressing Law Enforcement Concerns in the 95th District. The forum was cosponsored by The Bridge Center for Racial Harmony and SVAALTI Leadership Institute (formerly known as the Saginaw Valley African American Leadership Training Institute) and was streamed on The Bridge Centers Facebook page.

The forum featured a panel comprising Federspiel, Williams, Ruth and Saginaw Township Police Chief Donald F. Pussehl Jr. It was moderated by Bridge Center co-director Coral Dean and former Saginaw City Councilman Clint Bryant, who is now running for the state representative seat in the 95th District.

The forum was followed by a response section, featuring a second panel composed of four local activists.

Dean and Byrant asked both panels questions submitted by citizens on the Facebook page.

Watch the full video here:

Bryant opened the forum by asking the quartet of police agency heads if they would be willing to commit to adopting more programs that would help engage people of color and ultimately hire a more diverse police force.

Absolutely, Federspiel replied. Ive been sheriff for 12 years in in those 12 years Ive tried to cultivate a diverse staff. Im very proud to have a diverse group. If there are other ways we could diversify our staff, I would love to do that.

Ruth seconded the sheriffs response.

Of course I would, he said. Any time we can make our police department look more like our community, it benefits everyone. Im actually very proud of our hiring here in the city of Saginaw. If you look at our diversity within the department, we actually have a racial diversity of 33 percent. Thats pretty high for a police department. Anything we can do to make it better, Im all for it.

I feel the same, added Williams. I will do whatever is necessary to have a diverse department to interact with our community.

Dean addressed the upcoming eighth anniversary of Milton Halls death. Six Saginaw police officers on July 1, 2012, fired 47 shots at Hall, a mentally ill black man who was holding a knife, in the Riverview Plaza parking lot at 290 W. Genesee Ave. Eleven of the bullets struck Hall and killed him. A protest is planned at the site from 3 p.m. to 6 p.m. on Friday, June 5.

Bryant wore a shirt featuring Halls name during the panel discussion.

We learned so much as a community from this tragic death, Dean said. What are some changes that you can point to so we can ensure that our community does not have to experience this again?

Pussehl said police are always looking at how to best use the minimum amount of force and most effectively deescalate any situation. Since Halls death, additional training for officers and increased awareness of mental health have been implemented, he said. Ruth added that when officers arrest a person with mental health issues, they are now taken to an area hospital rather than to jail.

Some of the other things that weve done is changing the culture within the department, Ruth said. Thats an extremely difficult task to do, the way the officers treat citizens and that was done through training and training and training.

The use of cameras, both worn by officers and in their patrol vehicles, has also increased since Halls death, Ruth said.

I think that was an excellent tool in helping to build transparency with the community and help build trust, he said. This November will be six years since weve had (body cameras). I think the body cameras are one of the best tools a police officer could ever have for themselves. It also creates transparency.

Williams said it is mandatory for Buena Vista Township officers to activate their body cameras before they exit their vehicles and interact with the public.

I hope that my officers always do because if there ever is a question, I do not want to be put in the position of wondering or having to believe someone elses word, Williams said. Body cameras help us more than they hurt us.

The sheriffs office has in-vehicle cameras but does not have body cameras for deputies, though it is actively seeking to obtain them, Federspiel said.

Bryant asked how citizens can find policies dealing with officers interactions with the public. The agency heads said the policies are not posted publicly, but citizens can contact them for an explanation of the them, adding they have strict use-of-force policies.

The sheriff said his department has a lieutenant assigned to internal investigations who randomly reviews videos. Each citizens complaint is thoroughly investigated he said, adding the sheriffs office has had more than 20 internal investigations so far this year, most of which have been minor.

Instead of sitting back and waiting for someone to complain, this particular lieutenants job is to be reviewing, randomly, video from in-car cameras and audio from the officers who work on the roads, and also video and audio from within the jail, Federspiel said. I cant stress enough how important it was for me to get that position so that we have someone, of rank, higher up in the agency that can report directly to the undersheriff and myself so that we can handle situations quickly and appropriately should they arise."

Ruth added that all use-of-force incidents are reviewed by a sergeant, a lieutenant, and him.

Were very strict with that from a disciplinary standpoint, Ruth said.

Bryant posed the following submitted question: Research has suggested that unconscious racial bias often impacts human behavior. In your opinion, what can Saginaw law enforcement do in terms of developing, educating, or cultivating an internal culture to combat the effects of unconscious racial bias so it does not affect how police enforce the law?

When a bias is recognized and it is pointed out, it needs to be addressed, Williams said. There needs to be dialogue. Dialogue is the one thing that helps move us forward in the right direction.

Federspiel referred again to the diverse ethnic backgrounds and genders in the upper ranks of his department.

When you have people with diverse backgrounds that are at every level of command, that to me is an important way for us to gauge whether there is conscious or unconscious bias and we can address it quickly, he said. Weve had terminations based on people who have exhibited some severe forms of bias. Every case is different. Our goal is to make sure we have a safe environment that we are out here protecting.

Dean asked the panel if a police-involved killing occurred in the area that was similar to Floyds death, would there be an immediate investigation and arrest or would there have to be days of riots before something got done?

You dont have one man on this panel that would tolerate that, Williams replied. Not one of us.

The Response

After the officers spoke and an intermission, a second forum was streamed on Facebook Live featuring local activists Louis Thomas Jr., Indigo Dudley, Christopher A. Foxx, and Brandon Harris. Dean asked the panelists their opinions on some of the most pressing issues facing the black community right now.

A panel for four Saginaw-area activists gather for an online community forum on June 3, 2020, in the wake of the death of Minneapolis resident George Floyd and the resulting protests that have occurred nationwide. Clockwise from top left: Moderator Clint Bryant, moderator Coral Dean, Louis Thomas, Indigo Dudley, Christopher A. Foxx, and Brandon Harris.

The interaction with the police does have to improve, from a public policy level, Harris said. I would like to see anything that we do begin with public policy, and specifically transparency with oversight.

Foxx agreed that more transparency is needed from the police, as well as specifics on officers training and enforcement tactics.

The ongoing issue that we all see, which is not just against any other race, but against us as a black community, Thomas added. Its seen that the law is not for the black community; its more against the black community, as far as force-wise. How we can solve it is we got to be able to trust.

He suggested psychological evaluations for officers and evaluating whether they foster prejudices that would lead them to interact differently with people of color.

Dudley agreed with her panelists in seeking more transparency and psychological assessments of officers.

You can go to as many trainings as you want, but if you dont feel the need to apply what youre learning in those trainings, its not going to matter, she said. Those psych evaluations are really important. I, as a citizen, would like to know where your head is at, regardless of how you feel about me as a person. I feel like the only way to hold our officers accountable is to have those psych evaluations frequently.

Dean said the movement resulting from Floyds death feels different than the public reactions garnered by prior incidents of people of color killed by police.

Black Lives Matter, this entire movement, all of these protests, all of this anger cannot just be the newest tragedy of the month for 2020, Dean said. This is something black people have been dealing with for centuries, for far too long. Now, it has to keep going.

She spoke of the solidarity of people of all races, ages, genders, and backgrounds joining in the protests seen across the country since Floyds death. She asked the panelists if they feel the same that this movement is different from those that came before.

Dudley said she feels this one is different.

The protests are only the beginning, she said. If we dont keep the momentum going, nobody is going to feel the need to change everything, because at that point, were just complaining. If they see that were serious about this, that you need to change this, then more attention will be paid to it.

Foxx differed.

I felt the same kind of anguish, rage, and uncertainty in my position in the world and this community since Milton Hall, he said, adding he felt the same when Malice Green died after being assaulted by two Detroit police officers in 1992. Personally, this does not feel new to me. It stills feels the same. Its a lot of lip service and Im not really seeing any commitment to the change.

Harris agreed with Foxx, but added hes glad to see mid-Michigan communities coming together to peacefully protest. He offered a sobering caveat.

Im tired of seeing black bodies continuing to be hashtags, continuing to be a trend, he said. Its very frustrating even to put into words. I have a 7-year-old son. I dont want my son or anyone that I know to become another hashtag.

Im exhausted, he continued. So much rage, so much pain. If you do not want to make change, get out the way. Its as simple as that.

Thomas concurred with Harris view.

I would hope and I would pray that its going to change the world for real, he said, but it has to start not only with us, but with the politicians. We vote you into office to protect us and we dont feel protected, we dont feel safe.

Thomas said he feels like he has a target on his back just being black.

I didnt have a choice to be black, but you have a choice to wear that badge, he continued. Its scary. Im scared to even bring children into this world knowing that my son or my daughter may be scrutinized for the color of their skin.

Responding to another comment, Dudley said that she while respects police, officers comparing their lives to black lives, as in Blue Lives Matter as a reaction to Black Lives Matter, is wrong.

I am black, my siblings are black, my family is black; there is no way that Im changing that, she said. I cant change it. You trying to compare your life to mine, thats unacceptable. Youre held at a higher standard. You knew that when you were signing on.

Foxx added that police need to be more forthcoming in how their departments are improving.

They said theyre doing great, he said. Im not sure the community thinks theyre doing great. Id like to see from them their method of improvement. How are they quantifying improvement?

Foxx also said he hopes for a civilian advisory board reviewing citizens complaints of officers. Dudley agreed, saying it is important the right people are picked to be on it. Harris too called for an advisory board, but seconded Dudleys concern on getting the right people on it.

The forum ended with Dean saying shes hopeful more will convene in the near future.

Related:

Here are the upcoming George Floyd protests around mid-Michigan

'Enough is enough: Hundreds march in Saginaw to demand justice for George Floyd

Saginaw group spending 72 hours outside police department to protest George Floyd death in Minnesota

Police brutality protests in Michigan: What you need to know from this weekends rallies, riots

Flint-area police join protesters marching to seek justice for George Floyd

Peaceful protest in Grand Rapids devolves into riot, looting and fires

See the original post here:
Police discuss tactics, diversity and George Floyds death with Saginaw community - MLive.com